Who Is Responsible For Mould In Rentals- Tenant Or Landlord?

Who Is Responsible For Mould In Rentals

While driving home the other night, I happened to catch the ‘legal hour‘ segment on LBC radio station, which featured Daniel Barnett, LBC’s resident Barrister, insight on the matter of mould in rental properties; specifically who is responsible, the landlord or tenant.

He offered some great feedback and advice to anyone in that situation, so here it is…

Before I get into it, I should address the elephant in the room. I know you’re all thinking it.

Yes, I have a mortifying habit of listening to that absurd talk-show radio station LBC, which attracts a bunch of busy-bodies, with the average age of fossilised dinosaur turd (no offence if you’re an avid listener). Judge me if you will, I deserve it.

Tenant complains about mould

A disgruntled tenant stepped up and made the call into LBC’s headquarters, seeking Daniel’s pearls of wisdom. She complained that her, I quote, “completely useless landlord” was responsible for a nasty little mould outbreak, but she was unfairly being held responsible for the chaos.

The gist of the story is that the tenant was served a tenancy repossession notice by her landlord. Shortly after, she reported a mould infestation in the living room to the letting agent managing the property. The agent, however, told her that she needed to “make good of the decor” before vacating, claiming the mould was her fault due to inadequate heating (though how the agent determined this remains unclear). In response, the tenant defended herself by stating that she had purchased extra heaters for the property.

So the million dollar question, who’s the asshole responsible for the mess, the landlord or the tenant?

Under these extremely common circumstances, both parties usually wag their crusty erections at one another, pointing blame, calling one another every name under the sun. So if you’re in that unfortunate situation, perhaps I can offer some clarity by relaying the advice given.

Listen to the Barrister explain who is responsible…

If you’re currently at work, notify your dead-beat boss that you’re taking a well-deserved 5 minute time-out so you can listen to the following sound-byte. If you’re fortunate enough to be in the hot seat, perhaps you should huddle your employees together and make a communal fuss over it (yes, even if they couldn’t give a shit and if your company has nothing to do with letting).

Once again, Daniel unloaded some good insight…

(This was aired on the 11th of February 2015)

The key takeaways

For those of you who couldn’t listen (or choose no to), here’s the breakdown of what was said…

  • Tricky to blame the landlord
    The issue of mould is generally a tricky situation because normally landlords are legally responsible for everything to do with the basic build of the house, including the walls, but the responsibility for damp and mould is slightly different.
  • When landlords are responsible for mould
    Landlords are generally responsible for damp if it’s caused by leaky pipes, structural defects or a damp proof course going wrong.
  • When tenants are responsible for mould
    The tenant is responsible if it’s caused by condensation because of lack of ventilation, like not opening windows or inadequate heating.
  • Difficult to prove
    This is the key point.

    It’s always going to be very, very difficult to prove whether the mould was caused by inadequate heating or something else without getting an official assessment from a damp expert.

    On a side note, what an odd profession, a “damp expert” – I wonder who you have to sleep with to be a qualified one of those. I’ll do it. My C.V is so lifeless.

  • The deposit
    If it’s not obvious that the mould was caused by a leak or structural damage, then it’s most likely that the reason is due to the temperature not being adequately controlled by the tenant, consequently the cost of redecorating can be deducted from the tenant’s deposit.
  • Up to the tenant to prove innocence
    Rightly or wrongly so, it’s up to the tenant to prove the cause of the mould, because on the face of it, if there isn’t an obvious leak or any other obvious cause, the most likely explanation is lack of ventilation. That’s the most common cause of mould.

    If the tenant obtains a written report from a damp expert, stating that the problem isn’t caused by heating or ventilation and it’s actually because of a structural defect, then the landlord will most likely be held responsible.

  • Disputes and the tenancy deposit scheme
    If the tenant disputes the claim and wants to refuse the landlord from using the deposit to resolve the mould issue, the tenant can notify the tenancy deposit scheme in which the deposit is being held. The case will then be assessed by an internal arbitration scheme. But the problem with that is, the absence of evidence will suggest that the most likely cause is ventilation or heating.

Makes perfect sense to me, and it’s the way I’ve always believed the situation to be.

I’m no stranger to mould!

I suppose I should indulge a little and make this post partially about myself, otherwise what’s the point?

The reason this particular subject piqued my interest is because hearing the call reminded me of a memorable experience I went through in 2013, which entailed filthy tenants and a severe mould breakout, which some of you may remember. It’s an issue that I often recall and *shudder*

Unfortunately, in my case, I didn’t experience an average mould related event, but rather, my dippy asshole tenants, husband and wife duo, took stupidity and incompetence to the next level.

They thought it would be an ingenious idea to paint over a series of black mould infestations in an attempt to mask and presumably cure the problem before they vacated. Clearly not the brightest idea, not to mention extremely dangerous.

Apparently notifying me of the issue was not an option. Or rather, it didn’t enter their minds, despite the fact that I’ve always been a responsive and maintenance conscious landlord.

To cut a long and painful story short’ish (I’ll inevitably ramble on), my tenants fell into considerable rent arrears so I served them with an Section 8 eviction notice (never nice, but it happens and is often unavoidable, especially when you’re dealing with unreasonable people – which I was).

Like most bitter and delusional tenants that are incapable of accepting responsibility for their own actions, they instinctively took warmly to playing the role of the victims and acted like I was the bad guy.

“The mean landlord is kicking us out for falling into arrears. I mean, how dare he?

Uh huh.

There were a few unpleasant exchanges, but they eventually vacated the property. Extremely reluctantly.

I still recall the moment of relief. I know many landlords will be able to empathise with that feeling, when a rogue tenant is finally off the property.

So the next natural step was to inspect the property– something I wasn’t looking forward to given the circumstances. From experience, the blank and clean canvas that are given to “rogue tenants” at the start of the tenancy is rarely ever returned in the same condition (making allowances for fair wear and tear, of course).

It’s not uncommon for revenge traps to be left behind, whether that be a garden that resembles a landfill or a bathtub that’s been substituted for the toilet. I’ve seen and smelt it all.

The garden was certainly unkept, but it wasn’t too bad, and with great relief, the only items left behind in the bathtub were hair strands. Like lots of them. Thick and curly, too. I’ll say no more.

However, what was left behind was copious amounts of mould, which was smeared all over the bedroom and bathroom walls, unconvincingly hidden under a fresh coat of paint they had applied. Infuriating!

It was so obvious. Complete amateur hour. Because the knuckle-heads only painted over the patches that were infected – not the entire wall – so the difference in shade between the new paint against the old stood out like night and day. I have no idea what they were thinking (and that’s probably a good thing, to be honest).

After stripping away the top layer of fresh paint, this is what I was left with…

mold

Hideous, right? They blissfully stewed away in that confinement like a couple of diseased sewer rats.

I have a couple of cute chickens roaming around in my garden, but their downfall is how unbelievably filthy they are. They literally crap their pants all day long, in every possible variation; liquefied, solid, and often somewhere in the middle. They’ll also crap anywhere, they don’t care, literally everywhere, even on themselves, and they’ll happily stroll around with crusty, one-week-old faeces strapped onto their feet/legs. It’s repulsive.

What’s my point? Well, I don’t really have a good one, but they remind me of my tenants.

After I discovered the extent of the problem, in my haste and in utter disgust, I immediately contacted my tenant (even though our relationship was dire at this point, but I needed answers)…

There’s mould all over the walls, what happened? Why didn’t you tell me?

I tried contacting you about the mould problem many times. I have been sick because of the mould and so has my family. My solicitor will be in touch with you.

A blatant lie. The tenants didn’t try contacting me about the mould issue, not once. I would have addressed the issue immediately because I realise how dangerous mould can be, and also how expensive infestations can quickly become if they aren’t dealt with quickly. It would have been in my best interest to squash the issue ASAP.

Secondly, the tenants had debts coming out of their eyeballs; they didn’t even have the funds to hire a Solicitor, let alone appoint one to fight a frivolous lawsuit with fictitious evidence to support his fictitious claim(s).

Sadly, my tenants were adamant it was my fault. But either way, despite who’s at fault, wouldn’t any normal being try to remove the mould as soon as it was visible, as opposed to allowing it to spread so aggressively and then paint over it?

My gut tells me that they painted over the mould in an attempt to protect their security deposit. In fact, that seemed the obvious explanation (why else would tenants paint over mould just before vacating?).

Yeah, that wasn’t going to happen.

I’ve had the property for 7’ish years; I’ve had two tenants in the property before them and one since, and there have been NO signs or complaints of mould. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to unravel what was going on there.

From my limited experience, a lot of mould related issues (not all) in rental properties are caused by living habits/lifestyle, and not through structural defects, just like the Barrister said.

Of course, I’m not saying landlords are never to blame, they are. I fully understand that some landlords provide properties in terrible conditions that are conducive to mould growth, and they should absolutely be held accountable.

However, in my particular case, the evidence suggests this was self-inflicted. I’m pretty certain my tenants dried their wet clothes on the radiators and didn’t bother opening any windows or running the extractor fan to allow for ventilation. Needless to say, that’s a dangerous cocktail to ensure buckets of healthy and active mould-sex.

I never did hear from their solicitor. Unsolved mystery. Right.

Anyways, I don’t want to further distract from the useful information Daniel provided with my woes.

If you’re experiencing mould growth it might be worth going back in time and reading over my mould nightmare if you want more information on how to prevent/remove mould. I think it’s important to note how critical it is for landlords to take precautions to prevent mould (e.g. install extractors, use anti-mould paint etc) and not simply rely on tenants to utilise common sense (that’s a recipe for disaster). I learnt that the hard way.

Anyone got any hideous mouldy stories to share with me? If so, grab the mic and let’s do this like it’s 1999…



166 Join the Conversation...

Showing 134 - 183 comments (out of 183)
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Alicia 4th September, 2017 @ 11:04

Thank you David you've been extremely helpful. I can move out on one months notice (which I will do) however it's annoying to pay rent when I've already left because I was getting sinusitis and headaches - that and a comment by my cleaner is what got me to look into mould and get it tested! Ideally I would like to be restored to the same position:

Ie reimbursed for
Mould testing Costs
Mattress and bedding x 2
Health tests for me and acupuncture
Back rent
Days off work (I only get paid the hours I work)

In terms of a tenant I've been outstanding I have a cleaner twice a week, am hardly home, eat out mainly, had a Marie kondo expert help me organise the apartment and keep it immaculate!

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David 5th September, 2017 @ 20:14

@Alicia

The only way you can really claim those is by relating them to the Landlord's responsibilities in the Contract.

You can withhold your rent, have him take legal action and issue a counter claim, or just make a claim against him in the small claims court, keep it under £10k

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Hayley 31st October, 2017 @ 09:30

Hi guys - long term lurker, first time commenter here! Just looking for a wee bit of advice :)

Fiancé & I have just moved into a rental property, got the keys on Saturday. There's a multitude of things wrong with it which I won't go into, but there are patches of mould in the bathroom and on some of the windowsills. The windowsill issues are due to the windows not being sealed correctly in their frames, in some instances they are actually coming away from the wall completely.

When we viewed the property we noticed the patches of mould in the bathroom but assumed that these would be rectified before a tenant moved in. So when we've collected the keys this weekend and noticed the mould still there with no action having been taken to remedy, we were pretty unhappy.

My question is: were we wrong to assume that the mould would be dealt with and do we have any grounds to ask the landlord/letting agent to rectify?

For context, it's a terraced house with an en-suite conversion, the letting agent manages the property in full.

Thanks :)

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David 31st October, 2017 @ 10:16

@Hayley

They say that to assume makes an ASS out of U and ME, you were wrong to assume if you did not raise it at the viewing.

However, it is a health hazard and your first action should be to report it to the local council to avoid revenge eviction (Deregulation Act 2015).

They you need to tell the agent that there is a health hazard and you require them to deal with it and it's cause.

I would give them a reasonable deadline, a list of works required, e.g. to fix the window, treat the mold, seal the affected areas, redecorate.

Once work done you will need to keep on top of room to see if it is coming back.

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Hayley 31st October, 2017 @ 10:40

@David

Thanks for replying so quickly! We did mention it to the letting agent at the viewing though we didn't get any real solid confirmation (written or verbal) that it would be dealt with. I know we probably shouldn't have assumed but it just seemed like common sense? Potential error on our part, I admit. Then when we collected the keys it was just listed as part of the inventory around the condition of the property rather than actually remedied. I've told my other half I'm happy to deal with it myself when I'm off work but he's convinced it should be the landlord/agent dealing with it.

As I mentioned there are loads of issues with the place that weren't noticed on first viewing (including 3 of the properties 6 radiators having rusted so badly there are gaping holes underneath, leaving us unable to heat 3 rooms....) and I just don't want to push the agent/landlord too far with repairs before we've even been in the place a week!

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David 31st October, 2017 @ 11:22

@Hayley

It sounds as if the property is not fit for occupation if the radiators do not work then you can't heat the property.

I would get a call into the Council in the first instance, note you do not want the environmental health team who will just assume you made the mold and send you a leaflet. You want the housing team, they may have an file on the Landlord on record.

Once that is done then make a snagging list, tell the agent that if the work is not carried out within 28 days you will consider getting your own contractors to remedy the faults as they are serious health issues and hold their client liable for the costs.

For now you can choose to withhold rent until they have confirmed they are getting the work remedied. If you do that
let the deposit protection company know as well so that if there is a dispute later it is on record.

Also send an email with receipt request and cc to yourself that the condition of the property does not match the inventory.

It is important to have an accurate inventory and for tenants to make it very clear on entry any things not mentioned in inventory or else they could say you did them.

If the deposit has not been protected yet, wait until 30 days have passed and if not protected by then you may be able to take action against them in the future.

It may be that this is a sloppy agent rather than Landlord, but time will tell, some landlords do not want to invest in their property and use agents as a buffer.

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Hayley 31st October, 2017 @ 12:05

@David

Thanks so much for your advice, will see how it goes! I personally don't think we're being unreasonable so I'm hoping we get something sorted soon

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James 9th November, 2017 @ 07:45

I vacated a student property in the summer that I had rented for two years. As with many student landlords (mine was a builder), an additional bedroom (which was allocated as mine) had been created by a stud wall partition which divided the former lounge. The bedroom that I was allocated was therefore on the ground floor and opened onto the lounge by means of a fire door. The bedroom did not have any windows or air vents, but it did have a patio door with louvre blinds actually fitted to the internal side of the glass. The only means of ventilating that room was to open the patio door: not a practical solution to leave an external door open to the world either at night when sleeping or during the day - for fear of entry of rodents, the neighbourhood's cats or burglars! Whilst I did my best to remove the black mould which kept building up on that patio door, the louvre blinds which were fitted to that door and which did not pull away from the glass made it very difficult to clean off. I did not link the respiratory symptoms I developed whilst at university to the problem in my bedroom and it was not until a medical family member of one of the other tenants came to the property towards the end of the tenancy that the link between the black mould and my health problems, and moreover the lack of a practical means of ventilating my bedroom and barriers to cleaning away the black mould were identified by them.

At the start of the tenancy, the landlord had just completed some building works: the front garden was full of rubble and other building debris which he took months to clear. The back garden was not manicured either and neither did the landlord manicure the grounds when he removed the rubble from site. We left the house extremely clean and tidy on leaving so the agent could find very little reason for making deductions from our deposit. Whilst we had cut the grass however, the landlord decided to invoice us for weedkiller and for his time in applying this, despite the fact that the weed growth at the end of tenancy was minor and it was certainly no different to what it was at the start of tenancy. There were some charges which we could not argue with although all of these jobs were charged at around £60 per hour (e.g He charged for cleaning the Xpelair filter in the bathroom. He charged for replacing the cooker hood filter), but even with the unreasonable charges for weedkiller and also for touching up a couple of minor marks on the paintwork (we were presented with two close up pictures by the agent of these two minor marks) which really should have been classed as minor and fair wear and tear for a two year tenancy, we should have been set to get most of our deposit back. We are still waiting!

We have also had a catalogue of errors from the agent and whenever we have telephoned, there was never anyone "in that department" who was available to take the call. Emails have been frequently ignored.

It seems to me that some landlords and particularly landlords of student properties expect their tenants to tolerate everything and yet they deliberately go looking for reasons to extract more money at the end of tenancy (our agent even tried to blame things like discoloured wardrobes and drawers as "tenant damage" until we pointed out that the pictures he had taken at end of tenancy matched exactly the state of the discoloured (old) furniture at the start of tenancy as evidenced by their own inventory photographs at the start of tenancy!) Anyway it is now three months after our tenancy ended and they are still delaying the matter of returning our deposits. I suspect that many students don't clean houses as well as we did and that they are not used to giving people their deposits back. I also suspect that agents do not expect tenants to pursue things like delayed communication over deposits and instead do expect them just to give up, once they have moved on (miles away).

The landlord paid £173,000 for the property (an ex council house) in 2014 and was receiving rent of £15,000 a year from us. The four student tenants paid a deposit of some £1800.

Following this experience, my advice to every student would be to take their own pictures and document everything. Fortunately we have our own photographs and have kept emails etc and now the agent has now been given one week to reach a reasonable settlement with us.

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David 9th November, 2017 @ 14:41

@James

The health risks of mould are massive, I know someone who has a really bad respiratory problem after 2 years in a mould infested flat. In the USA there are whole buildings condemned (google sick building and see) as well as legal action for medical and other costs. The person I know is now so weak that he cannot work or even carry a single bag of shopping. He has pictures of the cause which was from a bad damp proof course but the Landlord promptly sold the property and is no longer a UK resident.

For your situation you may want to get a call into the Local Council Housing Dept and the Building Control Services Dept to have them view the property. Also let new tenants know and suggest they complain too.

The filters for the fan and oven are clear wear and tear items, you are spot on about the garden having to be in the same condition it was when it was given to you.

Not only that, the tenancy agreement must specify the obligation re the garden and it must not conflict with common law, especially their own obligations.

Your deposit should have been protected in one of the three Government approved deposit protection schemes; DPS, TDS & MyDeposits.

It is against the law not to protect a deposit on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy in one of the three schemes and the penalty sanctions of up to 3x the deposit go to the tenants. They not only have to protect the deposit WITHIN 30 DAYS but also inform the Lead Tenant with the Prescribed Information, also within 30 days. You can check the links below to see if the deposit was protected and in time.

bit.ly/chkdep1

bit.ly/chkdep2

bit.ly/chkdep3

If you deposit has not been protected, post back on the page below:

https://www.propertyinvestmentproject.co.uk/blog/i-havent-protected-my-tenants-deposit/

It is NOT the agent or the Landlord who decides the deduction, it is the deposit company.

When you leave the property you request the return of your deposit from the Deposit Protection Company and they contact the Landlord to ask them to make any representations for deductions, you are then given an opportunity to agree any deductions or dispute them, e.g. for wear and tear.

You can choose to have the deposit company as arbiter for deciding the deduction OR you can choose to take your Landlord to Court. If you allow the deposit company to arbitrate you cannot later take them to Court for that issue, but you always have 6 years to take them to Court for failure to protect deposit.

Although the Office of Fair Trading has been devolved into Trading Standards, their 2006 guide on unfair contract terms in tenancy agreement is practically a bible for decisions on these issues by both Courts and the deposit companies, you can download it at the following link:

bit.ly/oftguide

In addition to this the Landlord may have an unfair contract term if any term goes against common law. For example the requirement to mitigate your losses, this means that before a Landlord can hold you responsible for a loss they must have done all that is practical to reduce their losses before they blame you.

I hope you will see your complaint through, it is all part of weeding out bad Landlords and/or Agents who seem to feel that the deposit is a fund to finance their business.

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Tracey 14th November, 2017 @ 21:51

Wow!! What a forum, tons of factually incorrect on causes of mould, damp etc. Lots of ranting - Nige - grief!!!!

Please people, look elsewhere, never have I read such absolutely horrid rant's about tenants/ex tenant's.
Having been a private tenant for 13 years, and worked in property/construction, I have alsomseen both sides.
Some properties - due to construction/layout , simply lend to a poor envirinment & re,edial works may be appropriate. Some people do not ventilate or air a house properly & need to learn to exchange the air , ventilate and be sensible ref laundry drying , or other activities that cause vapour. Do your research people . Read about the dew point & study till it makes sense.
Landlords who refer to ex tenants as I have read on this forum, seriously the Landlord side - it aint perfect either, and many are charging ridiculous rental , for sub standard properties.

Having tomrebt privately, no-one really enjoys & can be an insecure way if life, made worse by problems in such properties - as mould, damp etc. Best advice - start with Dept Of Environment (Council), Property Chamber (PRH Panel previously), Surveyor or builder , offering free quotes or opinion. Declare concerns to Landlord & interact sensibly with. Stae your case & arm yourself with common sense help, forums like this do little in the real world, often cause people to worry or become aggressive.
Ranting about un-connected drivel, seems popular on here.
Living "normally", and not exacerbating a condensation problem (ventilate/open windows & remedy condensation when necessary), as I do- I still have high humidity & a damp feeling house (1950's semi/upper floor) , nkthing I can do more - like MANY on this site.

Belittling fellow human beings , ranting about tenants past, yakking about who/what you are, all kinda pointless - most people wanted sensible, practical advice- not read the riot act, literally.

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David 14th November, 2017 @ 22:15

@Tracey

I am a regular visitor here and I quite like the way people can speak their mind, bitch about nightmare tenants and landlords alike.

Thanks for your input on the mould, I hope it helps somebody.

I heard on radio last week that one of the factors in the current austerity economy is that people cannot afford to heat so the damp air is ideal for mould growth.

Also if you have paid to heat a place the last thing you want to do is open a window, ideally the property should have proper ventilation bricks or ducting for bathrooms without windows.

I have a nephew who moved into a housing association flat a few years ago, it had been riddled with mould, he complained to the HA but they said "yes it DID have mould but we have treated it, you can now paint over it" he did that, he used anti mould paint as a barrier in the places where there had been mould then painted over with eggshell (at the request of the HA).

I spoke to him last week and asked him about the mould, he said it has not returned, just a little on the cavities where the bath seal filler has been put at the base on the tiles over grouting.

So it seems that if you treat a property properly and put the right preventative measures in place you can get on top of it if it has not gone too far.

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Emmaline 2nd February, 2018 @ 09:20

Wow!! Shocked to hear how the landlords here refer to their tenants!!!! Granted some tenants are out for themselves but most aren't. I live in a 3 bed house with husband and 3 kids. We work, pay the extortionate rent and still are expected to live in a mouldy house! Landlord had just painted over any issues so looked ok when we moved in. Turns out the windows leak in the rain, guttering is broken which is causing the mould. Any landlords able to explain why this is still allowed to happen?? If we aren't happy we can move out?? With sites like this I'm not surprised some landlords are happy to take your hard earned cash and do bugger all....

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Emmaline 2nd February, 2018 @ 09:27

And why should we move out again with all the associated costs being borne by us AGAIN! Recently I think it was Peterborough ran a pilot scheme. The council inspected all private rental properties. Any mould, broken guttering, poor roofing, flashing, drains, doors that don't close, in fact any issues that make it obvious the property hadn't been properly maintained means it can't be rented. At least not until the problems are rectified, i.e. Not just a coat of cheap paint.....these properties were inspected again every 6 months. Also peace of mind for landlords who are kept informed. Due to low wages and shockingly high house prices we won't ever be able to buy. If you are lucky enough to own a 'spare' house then for goodness sake maintain it!

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Nige 2nd February, 2018 @ 09:54

@Emmaline
While I sympathize with your situation you raise many points.

The first one I will address is Government policy. Most landlords will have expenses and the rules on repairs and many other things have changed against the landlord. You then assume that all the rent goes into a landlord back pocket. It doesn't. For example if the property goes empty the council tax doubles. There is insurance and statutory obligations like gas checks. If the landlord employs an agent that could be another expense of around 10% of the rent. Then there is the background work of producing yearly tax returns and paying tax at 20% and it can be as high as 40%. Boo Hoo for the landlord you might say thats their choice to be in the business and you are right to say this. But where would you be without a (private in your case) landlord ? There are not enough social or council properties to house you .

This is no excuse for not carrying out essential repairs and remember the landlord is actually losing money on the value of the house as it deteriorates.

If you have real concerns you can contact various council departments to take action.

Regarding damp/mould etc. Nearly every investigation in 20 years where experts looked at mould in my properties it fell down to tenant behavior. My research showed that a family such as yours produces about 10 litres of water vapour a day. The equivalent of pouring a bucket of water on your living room carpet every day. It has to go somewhere and tenants are loathe to open windows due to high fuel costs.

Personally I would move somewhere else but that would be my choice. Then again it was also my choice to put off having kids until I could provide decent accommodation for them.

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Emmaline 2nd February, 2018 @ 10:05

@nige......I appreciate a different viewpoint. I am aware that the landlord won't be pocketing the rent. My issue is that we can be told, well, move on. No thanks, maintain your property! Maybe I'm in the minority.... But I open all the windows in the day, religious about the extractor fans in kitchen and bathroom and I don't ever dry washing on radiators. My job as a tenant is to be aware that our behaviour impacts the property too as you very rightly say. My point is that surely these are things that shouldn't be just covered up?? I'm in the south of England where the rents are very high. We were lucky enough to rent our last house for 17 years, we had a good working relationship with our landlord. For personal reasons he needed to sell. As I said before, I find the whole ' put up and shut up' or move along arguement rather dismaying. Maybe that's because I know we are top notch tenants....

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Emmaline 2nd February, 2018 @ 10:08

@nige.....one more thing, involving council or anyone else is a fast track to being 'asked to leave'. True for alot of tenants. This thread has been a real eye opener.

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Nige 2nd February, 2018 @ 11:13

I understand the predicament especially with high rents. As a landlord who had tenants pay cash it was an eye opener to me to see that pile of notes rather than a figure on a bank statement. Also knowing that in 30 days they would have to find that pile again.

If you have concerns don't phone, email....put it in writing and keep a copy.
A landlord has no hope of eviction whatsoever if repairs are technically forcing you to move.

Unfortunately as you see by some of the comments on this forum being a landlord can actually be quite hard complying with all the rules. This is one reason I sold up in my retirement.(not one house went back to the rental sector)

There are good tenants..yes I have had a lot but when you get a bad one..yes Ive had my fair share and more...they can cost a landlord one years lost rent. Just like the supermarkets and shoplifting. Prices go up to cater for these losses.

I do believe as was muted further up in the forum that landlords will have to register to be able to let a property under a licence. Unfortunately there is no database allowed under data protection laws on bad tenants.

A a landlord friend of mine says, and he has had a lot of smashed up properties. '' Tenants are all smiley smiley and on their best behavior when they need a property but don't give a flying F*** once they get it '' Thats why good prospective tenants have to jump though so many credit checks, references etc.

Just a note. Every single property I ever owned was let in a condition that I would have happily occupied it. Only one in 20 years came back in a condition that didn't need a lot of work and we are not talking just a lick of paint or new carpets.

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Emmaline 2nd February, 2018 @ 11:32

@nige.....I'd happily sign up to a good tenants list/register and support one for terrible tenants too. Valid points on both sides. As a landlord I cannot imagine the frustration of awful tenants, eviction process/cost, I couldn't do it! However, there are some nice tenants left that treat your house as their home :-)

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David 2nd February, 2018 @ 15:19

@Emmaline

The good news is that there are two new laws that will help you, but they will not be here till 2019/20.

Meanwhile you need to inform the Council first, give them photographic evidence, try to get them to issue an improvement order. Get letter from your GP saying mould is affecting your health and include it with email to Council.

Many Landlords will just issue a "revenge" S21 eviction notice when a tenant contacts them for repairs, however, if they have been served with an improvement notice the section 21 is void under Deregulation Act 2015 and a new one cannot be served till 6 months after repairs have been signed off by Council.

So the two new laws that will help you,

1. Homes (Fitness for Human Habitation and Liability for Housing Standards) Bill 2017-19

https://services.parliament.uk/bills/2017-19/homesfitnessforhumanhabitationandliabilityforhousingstandards.html

This will amend the Landlord and Tenant Act 1985 to require that residential rented accommodation is provided and maintained in a state of fitness for human habitation; to amend the Building Act 1984 to make provision about the
liability for works on residential accommodation that do not comply with
Building Regulations; and for connected purposes.

Mould is one of the things they are looking to address, note it also applies to social housing, this will make Councils more likely to enforce against private landlords.

The other law that is on the way is

2. Tenant Fees Bill

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/draft-tenants-fees-bill

This bill will reduce the cost of moving, all those fake fees and double dipping where agents charge a landlord and a tenant will be gone.

Landlords will not be able to charge the fees either and they will be limited to charging 6 weeks as a security deposit.

This will improve the fluidity of the market, some Landlords will increase rents if the agents charge them more but in reality competition and market forces will most likely mean that things will stay as they are and the agents will need to get leaner n meaner.

What is interesting is that it is being administered by weights and measures, so I think there will be an appetite for giving out a fines to deter for a while. The legislation even allows them to fund a case for a tenant in certain circumstances.

It might shake out some of the dodgy landlords too, especially those who do not comply with the law.

One thing you should check is whether your Landlord has protected your deposit and FULLY served you with the prescribed information relating to that deposit. Failure to do so may render them liable to a sanction of 3x the deposit PER TENANCY and you get that sanction as well as your deposit.

As for the dodgy tenants who damage a property, the best thing to do is report them to the Council as it will impact their ability to get social housing if they effectively caused their homelessness.

There are always two sides to every story, sometimes tenants feel over entitled, sometimes Landlords give them that feeling by being too informal. At the same time there are some "professional" bad tenants and some slum landlords, luckily most are just decent people in the middle. The biggest issue I come across is poor communications on both sides.

It is tough for Landlords but it needs to be, @nige is one of the nice ones but there are a lot of Landlords who treat it as a hobby and do not take their obligations seriously.

This site has some fantastic resources for Landlords, checklists and humour too.

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emmaline 2nd February, 2018 @ 15:56

@david, that's very interesting, thank you for taking the time to respond. I hate to be a complainer, but equally if I'm handing over my hard earned cash I expect to live in a property that has been properly maintained......To be fair, although I have to confess I was pretty outraged at some of the comments regarding tenants, now I've read some of the tales of horrendous tenants I sort of understand! I couldn't be a landlord for all the tea in China!Please be aware that there are still some good tenants out there, for example my husband is a plumber so any work that needed doing on our previous rental we did, landlord happy to knock a bit of rent off. Some people, tenants and landlords, are greedy bloodsuckers, granted. I've never understood why you wouldn't take care of the place you call home? I love this house. Just needs some tlc, we've cleared the gutters once already so hopefully that will help with the mould issue.

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Emma6 2nd February, 2018 @ 18:09

Emmaline, try not to be so anti landlords. We suffer it from all directions. We get it from the tenant. In spades. We get it from the properties. I swear boilers come to Buy To Let to die. Next time I can afford to buy shares, they will be in a boiler company. They've already got most of my money. We get it from the agent, who often forgets who pays their wages and announces that they act for the tenant. We get it from the Government. Do this. Do that. Pay for this. Comply with that. If your tenant does X you're liable. If you don't do Y, the tenant cannot be evicted. I am a good landlord. I take care of my tenant and my properties. My last tenants stole £1400 of stuff from the furnished flat when they left. I tried to keep their deposit to cover my losses. I was awarded £141 of it. The rest I had to give back. Landlords come here to share OUR horror stories, because NO ONE looks out for us. Absolutely no one. Tenants get new laws and regulations all the time. All landlords get is more hassle, stress and ways of being fined. Try and see it from our point of view. If you're not happy with your accommodation, take it up with the agent, in writing, and take photos and keep a diary of events. But don't tell us here that we don't deserve one website where we get to moan for a change.

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Nige 3rd February, 2018 @ 01:35

Well said Emmaline.
2 years ago I had a good tenant on DHSS. She caught cancer and although earmarked for sale I kept her in.
One day I had a call from the council who had previously inspected the property and photographed it as it had just been totally done up. Boiler not working. Tenant in hospital. Must get boiler fixed.
So we went round and boiler was hanging off the wall !! DUH.
Tenant died 2 weeks later. Of course her estate was valueless and as the tenant she was responsible.
In the 2 weeks whilst she was in hospital her brat teenage kids wrecked the property.
Guess what. All the council photos didn't come out.Well well well.
That really cost me as her brats stayed but were not on the tenancy and DHSS stopped paying. I couldn't even claim on my insurance as police would not make a damage report because they said it would be hard to prove who did the damage.Those brats 18 and 19 yrs old were rehoused. Pity the landlord.

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Marzanna 30th March, 2018 @ 13:53

Hi,
We have a mould problem too but in our case we have moved in 1.5 months ago, and the mould started coming out 2 weeks into tenancy. And now it actually growing mould. We have noticed that it is clearly connected with weather condition - last three days were rainy and we noticed mould coming out in new spots. What now - I am 100% sure it is not our fault!

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Marzanna 30th March, 2018 @ 14:12

to David,
what if the caused of mould by drainage - that what we think is in our case - it is impossible that we caused - two weeks after we moved in - we cooked all together 10 times maybe, average temp was 20 degree. Landlord simply painted it over.

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David 31st March, 2018 @ 18:59

@Marzanna

Whilst some Landlord do "blame the victim" the fact that you have been there for such a short time does suggest there is an inherent problem with the property.

Mould grows and damp helps it spread, it can be inactive in the walls until the right conditions make the spores grow, In the US they talk about sick buildings and hold the Landlord responsible which may involve gutting a building. I have seen one such infection in the bathroom vent, it was wet and very much alive, it went through the vent piping to the exit.

There are some obvious causes that are nothing to do with your lifestyle.

They usually involve damp from windows, guttering, poorly insulated walls on aged buildings. I was talking to a Landlord on here the other day who had an suggestion from the Council to change his windows which he did and treated all the mould, but it came back and he feels it is the main building guttering and infrastructure and maybe one of his walls.

You have to involve the Council, make sure they do not just send you a leaflet, point out that it happened within a very short period of time and appears to have been painted over without dealing with the underlying problem.

The reason I mention reporting it to the Council first and not the Landlord is for two reasons, first it creates a formal record and second because is to avoid revenge eviction. If the Council issue an improvement order and the Landlord does not comply they can't evict you, even if your tenancy expires.

Having said that, I would get out of the property if it were me.

A new law is coming out that will punish Landlords who rent properties that are uninhabitable, mould is included in that. Sadly you can't wait on that.

Take photos and keep a log. Maybe consider getting a private company to do a quote for treatment of the mould, bear in mind you need to deal with the cause. They have a spray that nukes it in place, it leaves it black which has to be painted over.

Look on the outside, gutting that leaks water down the walls, damp proofing that has mould growing above the damp proof level, it may be a different colour on the outside. Windows that leak into the brickwork around the edges.

As far as what tenants can do

Open windows if drying clothes indoors
Make sure dryers have exit pipe
Turn on extractor fans or open window while cooking
Open Curtains in the day time
Make sure window ventilation bars are open at all times
Open windows to mid lock position if fitted
Make sure that there the heating is high from time to time (24 degrees)
Create a gap between furniture and walls, especially external walls.

It can be a challenge for some tenants, they tend to keep their curtains closed to stop heat escaping, they may close vents for the same reason and they may not be able to afford to heat properly. However, it is my feeling that some properties are prone to it because they have bad ventilation, poor windows, water leaks to the outside. So blaming the lifestyle of a tenant is unfair as they may only be exacerbating an underlying problem in the building.

There is little point cleaning the mould without dealing with the cause, once it has been resolved it can be washed down with thin bleach (do not breath it in). Then try to dry out the affected area, hire machines to dehumidify and then paint with watered down trade white emulsion that has anti-mould drops (from eBay), the idea here is that the walls absorb this and it becomes a barrier. Then paint the affected area with several coats of anti mould paint (£17 for a small tin). Although they sell it as a final coat you can over-paint it if you have a different colour, but definitely use eggshell finish in Kitchens and bathrooms, maybe in the other rooms, this will keep the moisture on the top of the paint, you can then open windows if you see moisture forming.

It cannot be emphasised strongly enough that you need to get to the cause before you treat it.

BTW in my experience, private landlords are better than Council/HA's at dealing with mould, the new law I mentioned will redress that.

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Marzanna 31st March, 2018 @ 19:39

to David,
Thank you for you respond, believe me or not but we are doing everything what you mentioned. My partner has a huge building experience - and he thinks ( almost 100%) that there is a problem with
drainage - I don't think the landlord will fix it as it may even cost up to 10.000 . Probably we will have to move out, and he will paint it over and cheat another tenant.
As for the mould - it is growing exponentially, it't a wet wall up to may be 50 cm, the mould has started getting meshed. In my last place after 5 years of living we did not have such a mould as here after 1 month. We have notice that after days of raining it's expanding very fast. Temp inside is around 20 C. We have a lot of condensation so the windows are opened as well.
To sum up - the most important - how to stop this landlord from cheating another tenants.

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Elvis Oceguera 13th April, 2018 @ 22:33

How can I report mold on my house and landlord does nothing about it

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Gwendoline 15th January, 2020 @ 14:25

I have used the Deposit Protection Dispute Resolution now twice and they are very much on the tenants side if there is mould its most likely that they will make the landlord pay that has been my experience. Once when a child edged biro deep into the solid pine dinning table which then required french polishing at the cost of 200 I said I would pay half the DPS told me it can whipped off so disallowed the claim, very ignorant, if it could be whipped off I would not be claiming, try digging a biro deep into a tree and scribbling then to wipe it off, I wager the flat that he could not do it, I am really disappointed with the DPS, they seem to want to whipp landlords.

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Debbie 18th January, 2020 @ 21:31

I'm letting a ground floor maisonette to tenants, a couple with a child. They have been in property for 18 months and recently complained about mould in a bedroom and other areas of the house. I lived in this property for 8 years before letting it and no mould problem then. Tenants said they are using extractor fans, ventilating and using a small dehumidifier. How do I establish the cause of the mould problem - tenants or building defect?

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John Bull 19th April, 2021 @ 19:30

Well. I thought I'd share my story.

A relative of mine has a rental property in the UK, but lives abroad.

My relative is a bit useless as a landlord and lacks a sense of urgency. The house itself has always been on the damper side of normal due to design and exposure but is not actually defective as far as we can possibly tell. We actually had a chartered surveyor in to carry out a survey as the tenants questioned the fact that the issue was condensation and have actioned most of the possible improvements.

It's always been obvious that my relative isn't great at it, so I recently volunteered to act as contact for the agent on the landlord's behalf. I felt it was a case of landlord not wanting the agent to send their (crap) workmen in but then slowing things down by not getting back to agent promptly when there was a problem.

What I had not realised until I stepped in was just how useless the agent was.

Previous tenants painted over tiles around the shower without the landlord's permission and the agent's attitude was the tenants are making things nice. Now the next tenants are in the paint is coming off - funny that!

An electrical fitting has broken and needs repair which the agents themselves brought to our attention (after the first visit to the house they have been arsed to do in a year, yes A YEAR: due to Covid, the agent has used this as a reason to not even visit the outside of the house at all for a year). So I arrange for an electrician to attend and the agent suggests why not replace all the light fittings in that room. I said, (long story) valid technical reason means I can't really get this done with tenants there and I'll get the electrician to repair the existing fitting. The agent said it sounds like a lot of hassle and why not leave it till the property is empty when the tenants move out in the autumn? What, so they can then complain we aren't maintaining the house?! I suppose it makes less work for the agent, doesn't it?

And I noticed when discussing various issues in the house that if I mention a number of things that have been handled badly, the ones were my relative has been at fault are discussed whereas anything that would cast the useless agent in a bad light is ignored.

As far as the damp is concerned, the agent wrote a glowing report of how the poor tenants (who are paying 2/3 of the market value because one of them was self-employed and Covid means he now cannot work, by the way) are cleaning all the mould every day, which I know to be bullshit as I've worked in the house (I'm a plumber, but I do all sorts of odd jobs if it's for family) and the tenants could not seem to understand why leaving one window open all day is not the same as airing the house on a daily basis, which is what it needs, and it's one of the scummiest houses I have personal experience of. If they were cleaning off mould daily, perhaps it would add variety if they cleaned the grease off their bright yellow (was white) kitchen ceiling once a year?

But the agent wants to be the tenants' best friend for some reason. It's clear the agent does NOT know them personally and to be fair, I don't dislike the couple. The issue is the agent is working for my relative, but it's far easier for the agency to take the easy way out and leave the landlord to deal with the fallout. After all, the landlord pays them anyway, and being abroad, can't do much about it.

Not quite sure what the agent is supposed to be good at. Cannot communicate any technical issue properly, unaware of fire safety best practice and asbestos regulations, and then, when you say okay let's get things sorted suggests the best approach is not to do maintenance. Best one was when the boiler broke down and the agent said, well it is quite old and tenants don't really want boilers that are old, unless someone is on hand to repair them quickly. Whose job is that, who is the agent? FFS!! Then the boiler needed replacing as spares not available. But once I pointed out two stockists for the part, the agent's gas engineer suddenly realised he could repair the boiler after all. Then the agent suggested (having caused a delay in repiar by being useless) that the tenants needed a discount on rent because the heating had been broken for a week.

Sorry if this is a rant and not really about mould. I've love to know if there's a forum that discusses useless agents. Because I'm not sure how people this useless manage to breathe in and out without assistance and it would be good to find a decent one for next time!

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David 19th April, 2021 @ 23:32

@John Bull

I have very little time for agents.

You can rate the Agent at AllAgents and Trust Pilot

If you want to know what they are supposed to do visit https://www.arla.co.uk/

The better ones tend to be members of and certified by Arla

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John 1st May, 2021 @ 23:25

From reading this blog, it sounds like you hate ALL tenants, mould or no mould.

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The Landlord 2nd May, 2021 @ 08:06

@John,
I'd be interested to know how you came to that conclusion. Did you simply read this one blog post where I happen to discuss my ex idiot tenants that painted over mould?

Presumably, you skipped past the 6 categories that are dedicated to helping tenants against rogue landlords? https://www.propertyinvestmentproject.co.uk/tenants/

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