Reasons Why Landlords Shouldn’t Accept DSS Tenants

Before anyone gets firmly on my tits about this, let me just clarify, this is a follow on article from The Positives Of DSS Tenants. So please, no angry hippies or DSS tenants start protesting, this is just a simple flip of the coin.

But I must confess, this list is longer than the pro-DSS tenants’ article! My bad.

1. DSS Tenants have financial difficulties

Whatever the case may be, whether we’re talking about genuinely sincere and deserving claimants, or piss-taking parasites that prefer to leech off the Government than make a real effort of climbing out of the system, all DSS tenants are shackled by financial restraints. If they weren’t, they wouldn’t be claimants. That instantly makes them ‘high-risk’

Being a landlord is about managing risk, but more importantly, minimizing risk. And since this is a business based on cash, we need to do whatever we can to keep the cash flowing, and that’s easier to do when you’re dealing with tenants that don’t have financial restraints. But for a better example, we can use banks and their policy for loaning. Would a bank give a loan to someone on DSS? Very unlikely. Why? Because it’s unlikely they’ll have the means to make the repayments.

Why should landlords think any differently than banks? They really shouldn’t. Fundamentally, we’re all talking about exchanging commodities.

2. Landlords no longer receive rent directly

At one time, DSS tenants were sought after by Landlords because the council would pay the rent directly to the Landlord. Unfortunately, that changed a few years ago, consequently tenants now directly receive rent. The change occurred to encourage the tenants to become more responsible with money.

Historically, many DSS tenants caused a lot of anti-social problems for Landlords, but we tolerated it because rent was sent directly into our pockets. But since tenants have been responsible for their own allowance, there’s been a predictable rise in tenants failing to pass on the rent, and presumably spending the money on other things.

The only real security and compelling reason landlords had to accept DSS tenants is no longer there. Or at least, not as easily accessible. There are certain circumstances whereby it’s still possible for the landlord to receive payments directly, but it’s not a ‘default’ arrangement anymore. It needs to be arranged with the claimant and council, and from what I’m told, it’s ‘possible’

However, I have no idea when or how it becomes a viable option, and my guess is that each council will have their own set of policies on the matter.

3. Rent from a DSS tenant is NOT Guaranteed

Following up from my previous point, and adjoining with some of my upcoming points…

I’ve heard many people claiming that rent is guaranteed when DSS tenants setup direct payments to landlords. That’s nothing more than a vicious rumour. Of course, it’s usually tenants on Housing Benefit (HB) that are spreading the rumour in order to sway landlords into thinking DSS tenants do have their perks.

I agree, taking on DSS tenants do have their [extremely limited] perks, however, saying that “rent is guaranteed” is total bullshit.

Firstly, most DSS tenants have a shortfall to cover each month, which the tenant is expected to cover on time every month. That shortfall is NOT guaranteed. Secondly, and most importantly, the council have the ability to seize/alter anyone’s benefits at the snap of a finger, and there’s nothing a landlord can do about it.

4. DSS tenants need to cover a shortfall

DSS tenants will typically need to cover a shortfall each month. For example, if the tenant’s rent is £500pcm, they may receive an allowance of £400 per month. In that case, the tenant will need to cover a shortfall of £100. Bearing in mind, a lot of DSS tenants aren’t working, so it’s important to recognise that the benefits alone may not be enough.

I’ve had a tenant in the past that had to pay £150 in shortfalls. It was often late, and frequently required constant chasing. This may seem trivial, but believe me, having to keep track of multiple payments for the same tenancy every month is bloody annoying.

5. Difficult to get Landlord Rental Insurance

Rent Guarantee Insurance (RGI) is always a useful policy to have in place, especially if you’re not 100% sure of your tenants credibility.

If your tenant fails to pay rent, your rental insurance company will cover the costs. However, many insurance companies won’t insure your rent if you have a DSS tenant. And if they’re willing to, they may ask for a higher premium than a private tenant.

If insurers are refusing to insure DSS tenants, or demand a higher premium to do so, you kind of have to put the dots together and realise that their figures show high claims when DSS tenants are involved. If that wasn’t the case, they’d happily insure.

These insurance companies aren’t fools, so it’s safe to follow their lead.

6. The Council are useless

I’ve already raged about how useless the council are when problems occur with DSS Tenants so I won’t drag on about it too much. Basically, on various occasions throughout my involvement with DSS tenants, I’ve needed to contact the council in order to resolve outstanding issues. It goes without saying that they have been less than helpful and outrageously rude. You can read a more in-depth discussion on how the council are rubbish when it comes to providing Landlords with support.

For a quick summary;

  • The council don’t give a shit when tenant’s don’t pay rent (even though they are giving them an allowance)
  • They actively screw landlords over when the tenant falls into arrears by telling them to remain in the property until they can be legally evicted (e.g. after they have fallen 2 months in arrears)
  • They randomly start and stop providing benefits to the tenants, and give no fair warning to the landlord. Then the landlord is effectively left with a tenant that has no income.

7. Even Letting Agents refuse to deal with DSS tenants

A letting agents job is to find suitable tenants for their landlords’ as quickly as possible. If they don’t find tenants, they don’t get paid, it’s that simple. So it must say something about DSS tenants if more and more letting agents refuse to deal with them.

When a letting agent prolongs filling in vacant properties by denying a certain type of tenant, alarm bells should ring. I’m sure letting agents have dealt with DSS tenants at one point, and on the back of their experiences, they’re now refusing…

8. Claimant allowances can randomly change

I’ve been in the situation where my DSS tenant’s allowance randomly changed overnight. I didn’t get any warning from the local housing association, no notifications, just an unexpected phonecall from my tenant informing me rent would be short this coming month because their allowance had been slashed, and there was nothing they could do about it.

For several months she was receiving £400pcm, the next month it had been slashed down to £300 for some reason that will never be disclosed to me. It’s not even uncommon for claimants to completely lose their housing benefits overnight.

You’d think the landlord would be entitled to a warning from the council, but apparently discussing their clients’ personal finances is a breach of data protection regulations. Do me a favour, seriously! Meanwhile. I’m left with a tenant that can’t afford the rent.

Most landlords take on DSS tenants on the basis that they are receiving regular financial support, and the council know that.

9. Claimants receive their benefits every 4 weeks

You’d think the council would want to make it easy for DSS tenants to receive their benefits and pay their rent on time. They don’t, which makes it a terrible proposition for landlords.

The council pay every 4 weeks instead of per calendar month (which is when rent is typically due). This may sound like another trivial issue, but it can get terribly messy when enough months have passed and your tenant starts receiving rent on the 15th of every month and rent is due on the 1st. You’ll soon find that the tenant has spent the allowance long before rent is due.

Anyone else got anything to add? If so, blurt your stuff…

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702 Comments- Join The Conversation...

Showing 652 - 702 comments (out of 702)
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Rea 23rd October, 2017 @ 13:01

I am more than happy for landlords to discriminate against drunks, addicts, convicted criminals, or rent arrears, but there are many hardworking, honest, decent people, or disbled who are forced to rely on HB through no fault of they're own out there being tarnished with the same brush as louts and layabouts

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john smith 24th October, 2017 @ 16:30

The truth of it is these landlords are usually not hardworking "entrepreneurs" i work in the industry and a lot of them are spoilt brats that daddy has "gifted" all or part of a property and they just want to sit on their idle spoilt backsides and get an income from.
There are also greedy foreign investors (usually Chinese) trying to make a fast buck when they have not even visited let alone live in the uk.
There is also the rich housewife using hubby or ex hubbys money to avoid tax.

Scum in other words fullstop

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Penderyn 6th November, 2017 @ 14:45

"or piss-taking parasites that prefer to leech off the Government than make a real effort of climbing out of the system"

The fact you talk about fellow human beings like this (people you have no idea how they've lived or brought up) is absolutely disgusting - and fascist in tone

Ironically.........Landlordism is parasitism......earnings from lodgings is fine and I welcome it......but landlords owning most of the housing stock is sickeningly greedy.

You have to really hate a community to take up housing stock and make it affordable to most of the future...the youth

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Penderyn 6th November, 2017 @ 14:46

Unaffordable** not affordable (typo sorry)

The Landlord Avatar
The Landlord 6th November, 2017 @ 14:57

Way to take what I said out of context.

Whatever the case may be, whether we’re talking about genuinely sincere and deserving claimants, or piss-taking parasites that prefer to leech off the Government than make a real effort of climbing out of the system

I acknowledge the fact that some claimants are genuine and deserving, while others aren't. Don't you?

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Richard 15th November, 2017 @ 18:46

Just a correction: DSS (Department for Social security) was abolished in 2001 and is now called the Department for Work and Pension - 'No DWP' or No HB' (Housing Benefit) should be used instead for those landlords that don't want benefit claimants as their tenants.

One thought on this topic is that as Council/Housing Association housing has declined through either demolition or Right to Buy, more and more people are relying on Private Sector housing than only a decade ago.

Those that don't want benefit claimants living in the private sector should support more Council and Housing Association properties being built - cheaper for the tax payer in the long term as there's less Housing Benefit due to lower rents and more people are likely to work as work pays, paying more Income Tax and not claiming income based benefits.

I'm a Housing Association tenant in Sheffield.

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John Smith 24th November, 2017 @ 00:19

There shouldn't be any landlords.

Nobody needs to own more than one house.

Houses should be places to live, not a way to get rich.

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Grandma 24th November, 2017 @ 09:08

John - Gret thought - I totally agree. Now all we have to do is think up a way to change world economics, and human nature.....

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Sarah 11th January, 2018 @ 13:10

there are disabled people like me who can't get a proper full time job due to society being judgmental, am deaf and am more than capable of getting a job, last few retail jobs i had was nasty management and customers just because i couldn't hear them properly, i managed to do jobs no problem but it was never enough, even a full time student with a part time job sometimes have to claim for dss, even though you've had bad experiences, you could always accept DSS with the condition that they have a guarantor and signed contract, that way it works out.

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Stealth Bomber 11th January, 2018 @ 22:49

Sarah. Hey, there is no real problem at all with disabled tenants. Those on DLA are totally different, in both circumstances, and the way areas of the industry treat those on DWP, or housing benefit or DSS or whatever else it`s called nowadays! Insurers and credit reference agencies must have the statistics to hand, which back or influence their decision not to allow or accept tenants in receipt of such benefits. Clearly there is some element of risk to the property, more potential to end up in rent arrears, and ultimately conflict with the landlord and subsequent eviction. I have a tenant on DLA and he is a 42 carat diamond, nor is there any issue with insuring the property or credit referencing checks. Having a guarantor is not the cure all in bad situations either, as we operate under the retarded system known as Civil Law, you cannot force a guarantor to pay rent arrears at the time things start to go wrong. So it still means the first priority for a landlord is to get a possession order granted from the Courts and get the tenant out. Pursuing a guarantor through small claims comes after, and even then there`s a chance of not getting paid. People can live with CCJ`s and money judgements against them, that`s just how some people live their life. Sadly the Law lets them get away with it, which is why other areas of the industry take things into their own hands by mitigating the risks.

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Stealth Bomber 11th January, 2018 @ 23:16

Richard. There are lots of dynamics to your comment so lets put some points out there. Councils sold properties way too cheaply under the RTB scheme, equalling massive revenue loss. It also put homes in the short term reach of wannabe homeowners, only to find paying a mortgage is rather a pain in the arse, so it gets repossessed and bought by landlords at auction. Councils have also creamed good rent money for decades, whilst providing substandard homes for people, I don`t see their golden pension pots suffering, do you? Only the E.U. decent homes directive saw any real change and improvement to council housing. The flip side of things of course is less people are getting mortgages, either through banks making it hard work, or not having any interest in the concept of homeownership and being tied into mortgages. With that, landlords have a whole raft of working people to choose from, so they are now better placed to avoid benefit tenants. And the final nail in the coffin, hammered in by David Cameron was to pay benefits direct to the claimant, so rent is no longer paid directly to the landlord to ensure the roof over their head. He knew that this move would F**k landlords right over, but effectively it has backfired and we have a housing crisis to be truly ashamed of.

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Bridget 16th January, 2018 @ 12:09

I am on a low income experiencing severe domestic abuse. I am trying to rent privately but cannot find anywhere. Rents are usually higher for those on benefits. I recently saw a house where the dss would pay most of the rent and I would pay the rest. I could have done so easily but was refused. Why should I pay a higher rent for a shabby property because I am on a low income. You greedy guttersnipes think all dss claimants are feckless with feral children. Like myself some people find themselves in situations not of there own making and are penalised for it. By the way I have known professionals renting who have trashed properties and ran off leaving land lords with rent arears so not all professionals earning 40K are the same. Fix up and enlarge your cognition.

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Stealth Bomber 18th January, 2018 @ 21:18

Bridget. I don't know where you get them on benefits pay more rent on property? You may be subject to that individually, but it's not true across the whole industry, and ultimately you sign the tenancy agreement. The Landlords take on the subject is balanced, fair and a true representation of what's going on. You probably don't see the wrestle to get places insured, as many now refuse to cover homes with DWP recipients. That's driven by industry decisions, not nasty landlords. Your situation may well be tough, and that's a shame when none of its your fault, but the balance is, there's more bad tenants, than bad landlords out there. landlords are governed and regulated to the teeth, apart from thise who dont give a monkeys, but bad tenants get all the support from citizens advice, shelter and even the council, to stay put, even when they don't pay a penny.

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Mutley 18th January, 2018 @ 22:41

I've never known landlords charge more rent to tenants on benefits, but I have known quite a few landlords and agencies demand higher deposit and advance rent.
One agency informed me that housing benefit would only be considered if both parents would agree to be guarantors, and they had to be in full time work, earning above certain amount. The deposit would be double that advertised, and 12 months rent had to be paid in advance (but only 2 months advance required for non benefit tenants!).
I'm 49, my mother is retired and father deceased, so not acceptable as guarantors. Due to health I'm trapped on benefits, and while I might not struggle as much as some financially, I certainly can't find 12 months rent!

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Stealth Bomber 19th January, 2018 @ 06:32

Mutley. 12 months advance rent seems a bit wild! Landlords will usually ask for an elevated deposit, which is a deterrent to them who misbehave, it also covers funding eviction process should things go wrong. And its the norm to ask for a higher deposit when people have pets,as there's usually some form of deep clean or replacement needed after stinky mutts! Now for the twist! Our dumb Government is proposing ( or it is ready to roll out ) that deposits are the equivalent of a maximum of one months rent. All that means is that rents will go up across the board. And rents will be on the increase anyway as the Government stops contract renewal fees, it's a huge revenue stream which letting agents are losing. Another nail in the coffin for those on DWP benefits, as letting agents simply won't have them on their books. The flip side of course is there's a whole raft of working people cant get, or dont want a mortgage. So, where private landlords have carried the benefits housing gap in the past, that has now gone pear shaped, and numbers are dropping like a stone. Not be long before all benefit claimants are in (or needing) social housing. I tell you now, my prediction is that folk are going to end up in hostel type, shared accommodation in the future. Can see it coming a mile off.

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CJs 20th February, 2018 @ 20:10

The gross generalisations amaze me! All landlords this or all DSS tenants that. I rented out my house when I moved in with my partner so I am not a 'lazy businessman'. I may need it again in the future. I'm retired and it helps towards my pension. I've allowed toddlers and cats, dogs, fish. I appreciate how animals can be so important to people. However, my DSS tenant, who put herself in the position of having 2 children with no partner around, has just walked out of my house after 5 years leaving it filthy and some damage. Apparently, I am picking on her by asking for compensation for the damage and cleaning!!! Once bitten.......

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andrewa 20th February, 2018 @ 20:18

@CJ I have found that after 5 years of renting to anyone the property needs to be cleaned and re decorated. This is normal. How often do you paint your house? I need to do mine every 7 or 8 years, but then its mine so I can afford to let it slide a bit and take a bit better care of it, again because its mine. When was the last time you polished a rental car? I'll throw out my rubbish but polish and vacuum a rental car? Naaaah!

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andrewa 20th February, 2018 @ 20:20

While we are at it, landlord, how often do you find it necessary to redecorate rather than give the place a quick tart up?

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CJs 20th February, 2018 @ 20:39

I'm not claiming for any decorating - which is way beyond 'wear & tear' and will need to be fully professionally decorated, no claim for filthy carpets that have to be replaced or for all the little repairs I have stood the cost for. I stop at cleaning up someone elses daily/weekly dirt because they think the world owes them something. I am also claiming for broken items that I was not informed of and don't see why I should pay for them while she walks off to wreck someone else's home.

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andrewa 20th February, 2018 @ 20:52

:) I get about 10 years from " office" carpeting but replace it with ceramic tiles now when it is time for replacement. All tenants leave a mess, some give it a superficial cleaning but none do a good enough job. However a property must be spotless for it to rent again quickly.

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Stealth Bomber 21st February, 2018 @ 10:38

@CJs. There`s not much mileage in chasing a DSS tenant for compensation at all. If she has been in the property for 5 years, surely there`s been enough income to get a good drink out of it, assuming there`s no rent arrears, and a retained deposit should cover all but the most serious of damage. You can`t force people to pay, a money judgement will just stay held against them, with no assets or source of income it`s the end of the road. I assume you are what we call an `accidental landlord`, living with a partner, and renting out your old place. These type of landlords make up 75% of the private rental sector, but are the ones who wind up in the most tangles. So, back to the `reason why landlords shouldn`t accept DSS tenants`.
1. Many insurers now will not offer building (landlord) policies if the tenants are on DWP, or Housing Benefit. DLA is treat differently.
2. Because they don`t work, you need a guarantor in full time employment. Even then you can only chase them once it`s all gone pear shaped.
3. Credit referencing checks will throw it back as a liability. There is always a shortfall in benefits which the tenant has to find some means of making up.
4. The DWP and Housing are notorious for stopping claimants benefits without rhyme or reason. This leaves tenants way behind, through no fault of their own, and in a situation where they can never get back on track.
5. Those who work usually do play the game, eventually. Getting an attachment to earnings is at least a route that can be taken when things go bad. But you don`t really get that choice when dealing with benefit claimants.
6. When it comes to serving notice and moving out, they have nowhere to go. They are encouraged by organisations such as Shelter, Citizens Advice and the Housing Authority to stay put until eviction, or until they find them somewhere to live. If they leave the property they are classed as making themselves intentionally homeless. This is the nasty side of the system which ultimately is designed to create the `them and us` culture. Saddens me to see that it`s actually working, but landlords not receiving the rent payments directly is the final nail in the coffin for actually giving benefit claimants a chance.

Sometimes you are better served to just move on. Tomorrow is another day, and you get the council tax bill for an empty property, NICE!

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Dave c 22nd February, 2018 @ 06:35

3 out of the last 4 benefits tenants/lodgers have robbed me of my rent money. Thats why im selling up and moving on to a different business. You are all going on like its not their fault that they are dishonest lying fucktards living way above their means. Its not the system its the fact that more morally bankrupt people are on benefits than are working. The first tenants who done me over to the tune of 3k in lost rent court costs and damages hadnt paid any of their bills in 7 years. I have a family living next door to me now who are on benefits. Hes a carer for her shes a carer for the oldest son. They have a car, 4ks worth of pedegree cats that they plan to breed and sell and guess what they owe tens of thousands of pounds in unpaid bills. Its not the system thats at fault here people its the people taking the piss out of it thats the problem and all the government has done is give them more opportunity to rob their landlords.

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Dave c 22nd February, 2018 @ 06:45

@cj dont even try mate it will cost you more money and lots of sleepless nights for nothing. I went through the whole process before and after 3 visits the bailifs will hit you with a bill because they want paying for their time and if the scum sucker you set them on cant pay or wont pay (which is the more likely of the 2) then they are coming for you. If you cant pay in 30 days they will come to your home and make you feel like an absolute moron as 2 fucking huge blokes take a list of your possesions and put them under a court order. Dont waste your time use the money you would spend chasing them for a good night out to destress and move on.

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Stephen H 22nd February, 2018 @ 09:35

So this topic still rumbles on, still has the spouting of all of thes wonderful Landlords who are apparently being ripped off by terrible tennants and they cannot understand why ???

Hands up all of those landlords who voted for a party that believed in Social Justice !!!!!!!, OK, I see zero hands in the air.
So we have to assume that your voting habbits have created a class of people in this country who get nothing, who expect nothing and who take whatever they can get. You have voted for political parties that privatised the vat majority of industry in the uK and closed whatever industry was left.
You voted for a party that allowed those with wealth to increase ten fold at the expense of those without.
You sat back and watched as homes were reposessed, as utility bills went through the roof, as the working class were treated as the underclass and our children were sent off to fight in wars for Regime Change under a yankee flag.

Now you sit there and wonder why morals have been eroded, why no one respects your right to charge exhorbitant rents and why those downtrodden brow beaten individuals at the bottom of the socia ladder will quite happily laugh at your housing misfortunes.

Perhaps if you haad given abot more thought as to how the government were treating the poorest in society then maybe the poorest would have sympathy for your financial loss in the housing market.

The truth is dear LANDLORDS, no one gives a flying fig for your losses and when landlords bleat on about "I'm going to chuck it all in and swll my property", then that is music to the ears of many people. Simply because one member of the public should not make financial gain from the housing plight of another.

Housing landlords should be councils, not private people looking to make money from someone else's misfortune. You are morally corrupt. Either vote for a political party that has the interests of all at heart or suffer the social consequences.

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Dave c 22nd February, 2018 @ 11:48

Stephen h your comment is utter fraff. Stop talking out your arse.

I and many landlords do not charge exorbitant rents.

You know nothing about any of the landlords you are slagging off.

I became a landlord to help people and give nice homes to live in, because i had rented from shitty landlords who wouldnt do repairs. More fool me.

Many others became landlords by accident they worked hard to buy themselves a home and through circumstances cant sell because of the economic downturn in 2008.

Which by the way was caused by numpty fucktards getting 200k homes and 50k cars on the never never knowing full well they couldnt afford it.

Many people with your opinion are jealous and spiteful individuals you bleet about the haves and have nots when most of the haves have worked bloody hard to get what theyve got paid their taxes to fund those poorer than themselves through the welfare state.

And are now being vilified for making an effort and paying their way in society rather than taking everything they can get.

If i went into a shop stole a loaf of bread i would be charged with a criminal offence.

Why should it be different if you enter into a contract and have no intention of paying surely that should be a more criminal offence than just theft as you have defrauded a company or individual through deception.

A few years years ago action fraud was going to unis explaning to students that if the lie on job applications they could face jail.

Why should it be any different in the housing market.

Why should people be able to rob a landlord and then justify their rodent like behaviour with the phrase well hes a have and im a have not?????

You talk about private landlords giving up as music to your ears, well the piper is playing your merry malody for you all.

Watch in the next few years when the councils refuse to help and most accidental landlords have sold up.

You will then be bleating on about what utter wankers those same private landlords were for selling their houses or having them repossed.

Leaving most to go to rack and ruin.

This is already happening in the north east. Entire streets being boarded up by the organisation who took on all the council houses a few years ago.

When there is mass homelessness and the councils and housing associations refuse to help on the grounds of intentionally homeless or bad debt.

You and people like you will want to go back to the days of private landlords. You will have fond memories of how good it used to be when private individuals actually wanted tenants to stop themselves being butt fucked by the council for having an empty home.

A lot of those ex landlords will have no simpathy for your plight.

They tried got screwed over and wont go back.

Enjoy the reality you and people like you have created mate.

Watch how bad it gets in the next few years.

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Stealth Bomber 22nd February, 2018 @ 12:24

@Stephen H. You are clearly a retard who knows ZERO, about the private rental market and the laws which govern it. Most landlords (around 75%) only have one property, working class people, trying to secure some sort of retirement fund and nothing more. So when you grow up, and learn a little on the subject, you should see a bit clearer that the system makes victims out of one and all. Those on benefits ride the wave of debt and evictions, and single property landlords have to walk the mine field of steering clear of bad tenants and legal costs, which write off the income which they have. The system is set up only to favor the richest of off shore property holders, and they don`t give a monkeys about waiting months to evict tenants, nor how long legal process takes, as they are sat in the sunshine. A blind man can see that the Government hate the small fry landlords trying to get on in life, they want us to give up and pay into their cronies fraudulent pension schemes instead. Wise up mate, there`s no real them and us about it, no matter how the media, silly TV programs and other nonsense portrays it, we are all stiffed by the system.

The Landlord Avatar
The Landlord 22nd February, 2018 @ 12:34

Hands up all of those landlords who voted for a party that believed in Social Justice !!!!!!!, OK, I see zero hands in the air.

No point having a rational conversation with someone that knows all the answers.

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Stephen H 22nd February, 2018 @ 15:28

Ha, that got the juices flowing didn't it ? so go on then humanitarianists, tell me how many of you voted for a socially aware party ? or even a party that gives a dam about the poorest in the country ??? well. I#m still waiting, but it's going to be a long wait isn't it, because I would wager that you lot either voted Tory or UKIP.

YOU created the present conditions, your voting habbits and support for inhuman right wing parties brought about the present situation and please, dont give me that tosh about "It was all Labours fault".

Labour under Blair promised to deregulate the finance industry and every single one of you supposed devout Tories jumped ship and voted New Labour. Fom then on, non jobs in the council and social spending did not bother you lot one bit because you were all haveing your wicked way with the finance industry,
Investors, pension holders shareholders, every single one of you let your money be used to but into dodgy USA motgages and you did not gove a toss just as long as the returns were coming in.
"Well how was I supposed to know what my money was being used for " ?????? well you would have soon found out what your money was being used for if the returns had been no good wouldn't you ?

So it was you lot that collapsed world wide economies and brought about a right wing government intent on destroying social cohesion in Britain and since that day, people like yourselves have done your best to make sure that communities are split assunder in your drive for personal wealth.

Now you support a government that blames the ills of the world on the poorest, who are intent on privatisation of everything incuding the NHS and as long as that inhuman government leave you greedy immoral landlords alone, and encourage your destruction of society and values, you will support them at every step.

Tell me why have any of you got more than one property ? why do you need more than one property ? why do you think it is just that your voting habits prohibit anyone else from rising from the ashes and entitles you to a home but others have to pay over the odds for theirs ?

A man needs a job (you have taken that away), a man needs a home (you have taken the ability to earn a home away and support the depletion of social homes), a man needs food (and you don't give a shyte about that either do you ?)

Sorry but it has to be said, Private Landlords are the lowest of the low, Feeding on the poverty, suffering and heartache of other people to advance their own wealth.

You are correct, No point in having a rational conversation with someone who knows all the answers, "Rational" does not apply to private Landlords

The Landlord Avatar
The Landlord 22nd February, 2018 @ 15:43

I would wager that you lot either voted Tory or UKIP.


And quite honestly, that's why you're coming across as an unbearable idiot. Stop acting like you know every landlord. Your mindless bitterness is embarrassing.

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Stealth Bomber 22nd February, 2018 @ 16:57

Stephen you are going to end up in the loony bin mate! The WHOLE point of this topic is that private landlords are increasingly having NOTHING to do with the poor of society, who are in poverty, so how can we be exploiting them you imbecile. Most private landlords house WORKING people, either young couples who are denied a mortgage by banks (suppose that`s our fault too), and those who split up and go their separate ways and are looking to start again. Read the situation properly dumbass, this Government is making it more and more difficult for the huge majority of landlords, in the hope that they give it up, or at the very least it`s less lucrative for anyone starting out in the game now. Just another way of keeping everyone working forever.

So while we are at it, lets call a spade, a spade.

yes, there are bad landlords, but there are far, far more bad tenants out there.
And all the legislation and crap which comes out is only geared to controlling landlords, but funnily enough, it doesn`t even help tenants out either!

Seeing as you are on your society and social value high horse, do you think none payment of rent should be a criminal offence? After all taking goods or services without payment is THEFT. Working people who have done ok are actually kept down by bad tenants, and the Government likes this. They are not interested in working or even middle class heroes, the whole system works for the top 5% and the rest of us are all actually the same. Silly fool!

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Stephen H 22nd February, 2018 @ 17:05

Look, your type have created the underclass in our society, it was the fallout from the greed of would property tycoons. Your voting habbits that led you to vote for what was best in your own pocket instead of what was faor for society. I dont blame because that is the way consecutive right wing government have steered you and you willingly followed. You have lost all vestiges of humanity, of social cohesion and love for your fellow man. You are what you are and no doubt for ever more you will dress it up in excuses of how badly the financial world has treated you.

Please dont ever any of you set yourselves on fire, because the vast majority of normal people in this country would not urinate on you to put you out. Private landlords are a pariah.

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M.H.He 22nd February, 2018 @ 17:27

I can't help but sympathize with Stephen H.
Being a tenant in the UK is a pain, and being a landlord in the UK puts you in all the neat positions. That many of you landlords struggle because you can't really afford being a landlord, that is another issue.

I mean, a lot of you are whining about how tenants cost you money. Well, that's part of your job. They should be much more costly for you, and your rights should be limited massively. If you can't afford renting out properties then, it means you simply aren't up for the job. It's not a viable business for you. Period.

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The Landlord 22nd February, 2018 @ 17:52


Our job is also to minimise risk, which is why many landlords are now refusing to take on DSS tenants. The risk has become far too great due to certain legislations and other restrictions by 3rd parties.

Most landlords can afford to rent out properties, but not when tenants don't pay rent. How many businesses would last if their main customers didn't pay their bills? Not many. So I'm not sure why you're implying that's a business lesson for landlords. All you did was make a general point, which pretty much applies to all small to medium sized businesses.

If a builder got stiffed on a couple of big jobs a year, while paying out for all the materials and supplies... would that mean it's not a viable business? Is being stiffed part of the builder's job (or any other business)?

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Presidentpeters 22nd February, 2018 @ 18:42

The problem with with socialism is you eventually run out of other people’s money. Chew on that as you read the Guardian in Costa on a workday afternoon

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M.H.He 22nd February, 2018 @ 18:51

@Presidentpeters That stupid quote has been debunked by a Tory government that exploded the debt, more than any Labour government in history combined, in just five years - and ongoing. It also has been debunked by bailouts for banks, train lines and and and - plus the victims of Grenfell Tower.

I think we can clearly say that the current economic model is by far too costly for any society and only pays out for a very few people.

That you see renting houses strictly as business tells it all. In other countries being a landlord is a responsibility - like being a doctor isn't just a job, but an actual duty. If you can't afford it, you shouldn't do it. The comparison with other businesses is simple proof of that you are not aware of your responsibility and shouldn't be in this field of work.

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The Landlord 22nd February, 2018 @ 19:06

That you see renting houses strictly as business tells it all.

Huh? YOU'RE the one that compared it to a business, so forgive me for continuing with the notion:

If you can't afford renting out properties then, it means you simply aren't up for the job. It's not a viable business for you. Period.

In any case, it is a business (you were right). We get taxed like a business, we have expenses like a business, we have to watch our cashflow like a business etc.

Similarly, companies that supply water and heat, and even the local baker that sells bread- all running businesses, while also providing a need.

You're just going all over the place with your point. I know my responsibilities as a landlord, and I meet all my obligations, both ethically and legally.

My only points were:

1) It's high risk taking on DSS tenants these days.
2) It's perfectly reasonable for landlords to be in hardship if a tenant falls into a couple of months arrears.

Either way, feel free to keep twisting and turning, and making up non-sense arguments.

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Stealth Bomber 22nd February, 2018 @ 19:28

@M.H.He I sympathise with Stephen H`s parents! Politicising the rental issue is so dumb it`s beyond comment. Labour councils charge not much less than my rents, for their awful dwellings on awful estates, creaming in rent money to safeguard their golden pensions, whilst doing f**k all in maintenance. Tories just cream in the rent, outsource contracts to their chums and divert the lot in their own direction. Landlords are quite prepared for the risk vs reward process, that`s a given for any business. But effectively, the law supports none payment of rents, theft and wilful damage to property, there is no real recourse for landlords, and tenants just disappear into the night, usually by moonlight! Now that rents are not paid directly to landlords, the amount of non payment and subsequent evictions has rocketed. This is the straw which broke the camels back. Now most of these tenants HAVE had the benefits paid, so cue Stephen H to tell us all where the moneys gone!

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Stephen H 22nd February, 2018 @ 20:01

Crikey Stealth, your surely not looking for sympathy ???
I have to admire your courage mind you ! to have the courage to let everyone know you are a Landlord is a very brave thing to do. Of course the rent issue is political. You voted for a party that got rid of social housing and refuse to replace it. Instead they force everyone into a world private rental and people like you, who voted for those horrendous politicians, take full advatage of it.
If mortgage repayments are too high, then once again, it is down to people like you who vote right wing which gives even more freedom to the finance industry to do what they want.
I'll also bet that you voted for Tony Blair back in 1998, giving Labour a landlside victory and then did it again 4 years later,despite his left wing policies and his non jobs in the councils, and his PFI just as long as the freedon of the finance industry kept going.
Oh dear, what about when the financial collapse happened and all of you Right wing twits jumped back to Tory in the hope that they could ease your financial suffering ! Oh dear, no help was available because Labour had put the control of the interest rates into the hands of the BOE. hur hur.
So todays financial climate is all down to people like yourself. Our massive unemployment driven by right wing policies, right wing privatisation and the growing divide between rich and poor.
So now you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. You hope the right wing government will support you yet they have truned their backs on you, they dont need your sort no Landlord. So your on your own in the big wide world and the poorer people out there who lost everything years ago are far more experienced than you at life on the streets and how to get without paying for it. You got what you deserved buddy.

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Stephen H 22nd February, 2018 @ 20:13

Ah ! president peters, I missed your little comment there but let me try and educate you regarding my working day. I spend every single day of the week running a Social Enterprise that myself and my wife created in our town. We are a registered community interest company and we make zilch from our endeavours. Everything we do make (and by the way we create employment for 13 other small businesses, is re invested into the town.
At christmas we supplied a 3 course christmas dinner to over 140 local poor people including many many children. We had a Santa and everyone got presents. I am in the process of opening a artist workshop for Veterans suffering PTSD and am well on the way to opening the only youth club in the area.

Now thats off my chest, if any of you ever want any lessons on humanity or what it is like at the chitty end of the stick then please let me know. Perhaps you would care to meet young children who have nothing to look forward to other than their next meal, but, I dont suppose that kind of experience would sit well with your views of poor people would it ? have a nice day.

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Dave c 22nd February, 2018 @ 22:14

Stephen h

WTF has crawled up your arse and eaten your brain.

I was a junkie when i left school and spent my early adult life in a drug induced haze that i only remember small snapshots.

I got myself clean in a spanish prison with no help or support from anyone.

13 years ago i walked out of prison with the clothes on my back and 45 quid in my pocket. Homeless with not even a hostel bed to go to.

I rented a house off a company with 600 houses. They did no repairs and i had to leave because it used to rain in my kitchen.

I became a landlord to provide my people (the underclass of society as you call us) with nice homes to live in.

You are talking like we were all born with a silver spoon wedged up us. We were not.

With a criminal record no one would hire me.

Ive worked dam hard to get what ive got like most other landlords.

Ive done any job i could do to drag myself from the hole i was in, unblocked peoples drains, cleaned out bins, given talks in schools about drugs and prison (won an award for it), built websites, done seo, decking, landscaping and a whole host of stuff i cant even remember.

I own 2 houses with no morgages.

And after all the shit i been through ive got people like you calling me a c u next tuesday and robbing me because i own more than 1 house.

Goes to show what a small minded fool you are sitting there sprouting your bullshit and trying to rile people up.

Ive clawed my way up sitting learning and teaching myself new things to improve my life after working 10 to 12 hours a day 7 days a week.

I didnt get any help from anyone or any government, i did it all on my own and ill hold my head up high when tossers like you try to take the piss.

What i find totally disgusting is people like you who would condone theft because i actually own everything i have outright.

I dont agree with living beyond my means and having everything on the never never.

Ive never been in debt untill scum like you robbed me. And i mean those scum take home 3k a month in state handouts, theyve robbed every company they came accross in the last 7 years but im the c**t for kicking them out.

People like you are whats wrong with this country sitting there sprouting shit about morals. The morally bankrupt fucktard round here is you my friend with your entitled to attitude on life.

Dont judge a man till youve walked in their boots.

Someone like you wouldnt have lasted long in my boots you would have given up and gone and joined the que for the handouts.

Sounds to me like your a dole walla scum bag whos been brain washed by corbyn. Waiting for freebies to be given out.

When all the houses are back in the councils hands under arms length management.

You will be one of the first to moan about your human rights to a nice home.

News for you the councils of britain are not charities they provide substandard accomadation and do no repairs because they can get away with it.

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Stealth Bomber 22nd February, 2018 @ 23:27

@Stephen H I very much doubt either myself, or any other landlord on here is looking for sympathy, so you are seriously misguided yet again. What we are looking for, is you to give us the answer as to why most DWP claimants who get evicted, actually do receive their benefits in full, yet still pay no rent. That has nothing to do with politics, that's about mentality, responsibility, choice, and the law effectively supporting their behaviour. Non payment of rent, without any conflict, should be criminalised for the theft that it is, and rents should be paid directly to landlords by the DWP, like it used to be, that would halt the majority of these situations in a heartbeat. The right wing Government has set things up this way to shaft landlords and deter them from continuing in property, or those that are thinking of doing it. They are actually using benefit claimants to do their dirty work, knowing full well they will blow the money without paying the rent, can`t you see it? You must be off your nut if you think most landlords vote right wing! Seems to me that you are caught in the two extremes of rental housing, and that really does make you a dumb ladypart. Anyone who uses the terms `property tycoon` and `exorbitant rents` really does not have a fookin clue about the real rental market. So let me enlighten you, before you post anymore inane comments. Private landlords have a whole raft of choice of WORKING people. We don`t need to ease the social housing crisis, nor your conscience. Private landlords clearly have a better market than needing to rely on benefit claimants for tenants. Younger generations see the rip off that home ownership and mortgages have become, and choose to rent and spend more on their lifestyle. Then there`s couples who get divorced, neither of which can afford to carry a mortgaged property on their own, they rent as well. It`s also true that many folk are now becoming rather useless, or scared, or financially strained, when it comes to maintenance and repairs, so they are happy to let landlords take that burden, and when you stop believing all the sh!t on the TV, you may find that some landlords are actually pretty red hot when it comes to repair and maintenance. A happy house means happy tenants, and a quiet telephone for us, and after all, that`s the property value which this right wing Government that we voted for (not), is going to steal when we end up in a care home. So there you go, now you can clearly see we are far, far, from being alone in the world of private rental. Yes, it`s not as good as it used to be, but it still beats pensions hands down, in securing the future, guaranteeing retirement, and a fair lifestyle. There`s a green eyed monster lurking in your posts, and whilst you are certainly clueless, and need to learn a whole lot more about the rental market, being jealous just makes you a ladypart!

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Presidentpeters 23rd February, 2018 @ 08:19

You work all day with the disadvantaged and can’t ever conceive that they would ever in a single case be in the wrong/ always stick by their promises (accommodation wise or whatever). Doesn’t stack up mate.

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Stephen H 23rd February, 2018 @ 09:39

You believe what you want matey, your failure to comprehend is a direct result of your failure to allow humanity into your world. Yes these people get things wrong, yet they are the first to jump to the rescue of someone who is worse off than they are.
Stealth, Oh, I see, so you rent out property because your intent on supplying a public service ?- BS buddy, you do for the same reason as every other landlord, you do it for the hard cash and then whinge like a biatch when someone way less fortunate than you decides to elope with the rent money.
Why do you need to be a landlord ? why do you need to have more than one home ? why do you (as you claim) continually suffer the loss of stolen rent money ? _ could it be because you have tyhis overriding urge to do some social good ? - Pffft. Listen Landlord, you do it for the cash and because it feeds your ego to claim to be some back street property tycoon. There should be only one Landlord and that is the local council. Any other landlord is on a par with a money lender.

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Benji 23rd February, 2018 @ 17:08

"There should be only one Landlord and that is the local council."

None of my tenants want to live on council sink estates, they prefer renting my nicer homes in better class areas
- clearly they don't know what's best for 'em!

What they really need is some clueless, communist, pretentious prick telling them how to live their lives.

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Stealth Bomber 23rd February, 2018 @ 20:00


Pissing myself laughing, comedy gold you are mate, what a clown.

So you like councils stealing taxpayers money, providing woeful dwellings, on estates which would give Syria a run for it`s money, charging rents not too much cheaper than mine, whilst making sure they keep that golden pension pot overflowing, have properties abroad, and claiming expenses on things they don`t even live in.

You like benefit tenants having no interest in paying rents, it`s not eloping with money, IT`S THEFT, so you need to be absolutely crystal clear on that. Taking goods or services without paying is THEFT. Try it next time you go shopping.

You never read where I claim to be supplying a public service, so stop lying to suit your own ends. It`s simply supply and demand of the time. Private landlords carried the student accommodation shortage when Universities boomed, no problems there. Uni`s recognised they needed to find an answer, and some support from private sector. Students never got evicted, most worked one, or even two jobs, rents paid, get a degree, move on. Why do you think benefit tenants should be allowed to behave rather differently? The example proves it`s more down to discipline, attitude and mentality, rather than some political social disaster. Face facts and accept the real truth, the best thing you can do for humanity is open a sterilisation clinic! Breeding us into oblivion, and everyone demanding housing, especially with zero means of funding or income, simply cannot be. People are going to end up in trailer parks, or living in hostel type, shared accommodation, you mark my words sunshine because it`s coming, and that will not be the fault of private landlords at all. It`s called keeping your legs shut, and making better choices.

Nor do I continually suffer the loss of rent money, it happened once, when giving benefit claimants a chance, which is precisely what this thread is all about! Minimising the risk of non payment, by avoiding DWP claimants altogether. Are you catching on yet? Nor should it cost to go through the legal process of getting your own house back. The Taxman or Mortgage lender would walk straight in and take the property back, regardless of tenant occupancy, if I owed them money!

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Stephen H 24th February, 2018 @ 10:37

YOU LOT,created the sink estates and the underclass and the idiots that run offd without paying their rents. YOU LOT allowed right wing governments to take away communities, whole commun ities built up around huge industries tghat YOU LOT allowed right wing governmen ts to close.

The loss of those communities (and we are talking millions of people) led to a loss of morals, of values and of decency as hard working families were told "Kiss my ass there is no work for you nor your kids now or in the future".

YOU LOT, voted for and allowed that to happen. So all of those forsaken people looked for the only other option open to them. Get through life as well as you can spending as little as possible because that is what governments have done to you.

So now there are no (or very few) proud working class left, they have been replaced by a breed of person that YOU LOT created who have learned to take whatever they can get and not worry about the consequences.

Steelworking communities, Mining Communities, Fishing Communities etc etc, all lost that ethic of "Get up and go earn a living" because YOU LOT allowed the government to take that living away for nothing more than shareholder profits.

So the product of those estates now, the way they think and the way they act is a direct result of what the type of person who has more than one home has created.

Man needs work - your voting habbits took that away. Man needs a home, - your voting habbits took that away, man needs a family !! well thats one that YOU LOT haven'y managed to atke away because they are still having families and they are still provding for them by ripping off people like yourselves with the same contempt that you show them every time you vote for right wing governments who try to destroy them.

So I dont care what your claimed backgrounds are, if you have more than one home then YOU LOT are living on other people's misery, you are not providing some wonderful caring service that everyone should be grateful for, stop hiding behind a lie.

You may convince some people you are the real deal but sorry, I'm not that stupid, I see through to the greed. Have fun with your undercalss, I hope you learn something valuable from them but alas, your right wing minds are made up and are set in profit mode.

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Benji 24th February, 2018 @ 18:23

Whevs.. Up the revolution comrade!

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Stealth Bomber 25th February, 2018 @ 13:48

@Stephen H. You can stop commenting now, your status as a complete and utter imbecile is secured. Honestly man, read your own lunatic comments, and get yourself some help. You have blamed everyone who votes Tory, have voted Tory, AND everyone who voted for Blair, go figure!

You are also blaming people who weren`t even born, when Maggie closed the pits down, let alone old enough to vote. So who do you blame then, our mum and dad, nannan and grandad, great nannan and grandad, Adolf Hitler, Henry the 8th? It`s pitiful reading it to be honest.

We can only deal with the situations that occur at any given time in our life, and make the best of things, without stealing. It`s only those whom you endorse, that drag society down. They breed kids which don`t have a chance, because their parents have neither the means nor mentality themselves, to raise offspring in the first place. There`s no `raising a wholesome family unit`, so don`t kid yourself fool, children are a source of income and not much more.

Remember this, there`s only two types of animal which expect someone else to provide a nest, AND feed it`s kids.

I suppose you could say they both start with `C`, and ones a Cuckoo!

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andrewa 25th February, 2018 @ 14:33

Bwahahahahahaha +1

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Stephen H 25th February, 2018 @ 16:06

Ok Stealth, you win, I'll stop posting now. There's no point in going on because you have all proved you are so far up your own selfish me me me backsides you have lost sight of humanity.
So you keep kidding yourselves that you are all supplying this wonderful public service (for the highest of moral reasons of course), and those of us who mix with normal people will keep on believing the truth. If you let me have your address I'll see if I can find a suitable Christmas card to send you,

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Stealth Bomber 25th February, 2018 @ 21:20

@Stephen H. It`s for the best, it really is!

Blindingly obvious that you don`t even read people`s comments properly, lost in your own world of hate, spouting vitriol like something that`s stuck in the 70`s. But when Letting Agents, Insurers and Landlords are all turning against DWP and Housing Benefit claimants, it`s got to tell you something, and it`s not all down to the mighty dollar and vast profits, so you really do need to get a grip.
There`s a world of difference in humanity, people having a home, and the cuckoos you are defending. Strange thing is, you seem to think it`s a small victory, when they get away with non payment of rent, and while that makes the landlord a victim in the short term, it only happens to them once (or should do), and those 8 or so months it may take to get the thieves out, do eventually come to an end.
For cuckoos, they have to keep moving on, and try to pull the same stunt elsewhere. And this is where I suspect your real anger lies, because the game is up where private landlords are concerned. And that`s why you come to Landlord sites to vent.

Next stop, Trailer Parks and Shared accommodation/hostels for them there cuckoos I am afraid. Can see it coming a mile off, the Country simply can`t provide house after house after house, free of charge, to all those who are breeding wonderful wholesome families.

Save the Christmas card, the best present you can give to humanity is get that Sterilisation Clinic open sharpish. I will even cut the ribbon and declare it OPEN!


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